Speaker 1 0:11

welcome another episode of hold my cutter coming your way here at burn by rocky patel, down the road from pnc park, our special guest kent, to call v, who pitched in relief more times than any other National League pitcher Any, any, any In baseball history. And he recommended the number six, rocky Patel, which we are enjoying now with a 95 rating. 90, that's about how hard Teague threw in the day. Well, my wish. Well, whatever Medium-bodied cigar wrapped in stunning Honduran Corojo leaf offering a balanced blend of sweetness and pepper that appeals to both mild and medium to full bodied smokers alike. And our guests here at Burned by Rocky Patel receive gift cards from the great David Allen, david Allen clothing. And those gift cards allow you the opportunity to check out pittsburgh's premier men's custom suit and custom clothing experts. Schedule a free fitting with a stylist at our lounge in mount lebanon. And we also want to thank, as always the great, our cats from berkshire hathaway. Yes, berkshire hathaway home services.

Speaker 1 1:23

Ask Berkshire Hathaway Home Services. Ask Eric Katz at Ask Era. That's A-R-A-H. Katz, k-a-t-z. Go to askerikatzcom Buying or selling a home. Nobody better than Eric Katz and nobody better as a reliever. And became a longtime color analyst After your days with the Philadelphia Phillies. Previous episode Kent Ekovi, we talked about your days pitching, but we didn't get into yet the opportunity to be a broadcaster. When you were pitching, when you were playing, did you think down the road like McHenry? When McHenry first came into the big leagues, one of the first things he said was I'm going to be a top podcaster.

Speaker 2 2:02

I'm going to be a pre and post game Were you like that? Yeah, I was absolutely like that. I had no idea.

Speaker 1 2:09

No idea, amen, no idea.

Speaker 2 2:11

I had no thoughts at all. In fact, the way it happened, I had retired at the age of 42, came back, did a little PR work.

Speaker 3 2:22

At the young age of 42?

Speaker 2 2:23

At the young age of 42.

Speaker 3 2:25

I'm not 40. No, I was a worn-out 42. Not even 40, yet that's incredible.

Speaker 2 2:27

I was a worn-out 42.

Speaker 1 2:29

When did you think about McHenry? When did you think about it, about broadcasting? How old were you?

Speaker 3 2:35

Never, never. I didn't. I was terrified to do it. Learning disabilities growing up I'm sure everybody's heard that story, but yeah, I got an opportunity when Teek was here.

Speaker 1 2:45

Oh, that's okay, We'll get into it, all right, all right yeah it's one of those things that's really neat.

Speaker 3 2:48

It's because Teek's such a great guy. I'm sure that's how that door opened.

Speaker 2 2:51

Well, I'll tell you what the door opened accidentally for me you didn't kick it in he. I had done some PR work for the Pirates, just working around the ballpark, going around thanking people, stuff like that, doing a few speeches here or there or whatever you sound like a politician. The year after I retired.

Speaker 3 3:10

yeah, yeah, kind of yeah, kissing babies.

Speaker 2 3:25

And all of a sudden, my second year. I'm still doing the same thing, or I'm getting ready to do the same thing. The season has just started. About two weeks into the season, the Phillies fired their manager and named Jim Fregosi their new manager. Well, jim Fregosi had been working in the front office as a consultant and a bunch of other stuff, and one of the things he was doing was they had a package on Sports Channel that they called it was a 25-game package. It was their smallest TV package. It was just select games and they did them over. They spread them out over the course of the whole year. Well, fregosi gets the manager's job, so he can't be the analyst on this TV package anymore in the middle of April. So they've got a whole season full of almost 20. It was a 25-game package. I think he did one and it was like a miserable long 14-inning game in the cold at Shea Stadium.

Speaker 2 4:23

He was miserable about it. He told me the story later. So the Phillies decided let's go back through all the guys we've had over the years and just anybody that we think might be good. Bring each one of them in for three, four, five games during the course of the season and we'll fill that spot over the course of this year, just to finish out the schedule, and then next year we'll figure out what we're going to do with it.

Speaker 2 4:49

Well, I happen to be, for some reason, who spent probably the least amount of time on anybody in philadelphia as a player. Uh, one of the guys that they called I mean they called me, it was mike schmidt, it was greg gross, jake Johnstone, gary Maddox you know guys with personalities that they thought could do a little speaking. So I ended up doing five games. I mean literally how much preparation I had for it. I got a call on a Tuesday saying would you even think about it? Have you ever thought about broadcasting? No, not really. Says well, you know, explain to me, not really. Says well, explain to me what happened. Says well, this was on Tuesday. Says well, would you be interested? I don't know if I'll be any good, I'll try.

Speaker 2 5:34

It Says well, okay, get a plane tomorrow, fly to Montreal, you're doing the game Thursday night. Says well, don't you? You know, do we need to have a meeting or talk? No, don't worry about it, we'll just figure it out as we go. So literally that's how I got into broadcasting is show up on Thursday and we'll figure out what's going to happen. So I get there on Thursday, I'm working with Andy Musser, sit down with Ray Tipton, the producer, before the game. We're having the dinner and fortunately, fregosi and I had played together. He was here with the Pirates for a while, so I knew Jim and some of the players on the Phillies team were still guys that I was familiar with from a couple of years ago when I was still playing. So Jim being Jim put together an entire lineup that night of people that I would know. He did not have any of his new guys that had come in in the last three years.

Speaker 1 6:32

I'm going to help out my buddy, my broadcaster Kent to call me by putting in the guys that he knows.

Speaker 3 6:38

Now I wonder if that's better or if Walk making the lineup in the big leagues is better.

Speaker 2 6:42

I can make a better lineup than this.

Speaker 3 6:44

That's pretty good Baseball's great.

Speaker 2 6:45

Well, I'll tell you what, though. Our friendship was good before.

Speaker 1 6:50

It really bonded that night, my gosh.

Speaker 2 6:53

So that was my introduction to broadcasting. It ended up doing a total of five games over the course of the whole season. Some of them were on the road, some of them were in Philadelphia. It was like, yeah, let's do it one game a month. You know which is not easy. And the the greatest part was we. We had the dinner, right.

Speaker 2 7:13

We went up to the press room before we started and it was ray tipton. Myself and andy were sitting there and uh, ray gets ready to leave. He says, uh, we're gonna, because we used to um, because we used to rehearse. No, we taped the open, we used to tape the open. So he says we're going to tape the open or we're going to tape the stand-up at you know, 6.50, whatever time it was, 7.05, game, 6.50. Okay, so he leaves and he goes upstairs, or he goes to the truck or wherever he goes, and I look at Andy and I go Andy. He says what's a stand-up? He says Andy, andy. You know, andy, andy being Andy, he looks at me and he goes. You stand up right next to me and answer whatever question I ask you.

Speaker 1 8:00

Pretty simple.

Speaker 2 8:01

I can do that, I have done that before. I can do that, I have done that before, I can do that. And that was my introduction to broadcasting and my first lesson of what you do as a broadcaster. We literally went by the seat of our pants through the whole five games that I did.

Speaker 1 8:17

Did you work with Andy each time?

Speaker 2 8:20

Sometimes with Harry, right? No, I worked with Andy and I worked with Chris Wheeler.

Speaker 1 8:23

Did you ever work with Harry?

Speaker 2 8:25

No, Harry and Rich? No, I worked with Andy and I worked with Chris Wheeler. Did you ever work with Harry? No, Harry and Richie Ashburn worked together all the time they did radio together.

Speaker 1 8:29

Okay.

Speaker 2 8:30

We did the.

Speaker 1 8:31

This was the third tier TV package. But as you went along, did you ever work with Harry? No, harry and Richie Ashburn did radio together solely by themselves for years. Always a team Wow.

Speaker 2 8:47

It was Chris Wheeler, it was Andy Musser, chris Wheeler most of the time. And then toward the end there were a couple other guys that came in that I was working with, that were doing the play-by-play.

Speaker 1 8:59

Now people who aren't very familiar are scrambling like wondering how to call me with the Phillies. People may not realize that you didn't spend your entire career as a pirate. It seems that way.

Speaker 3 9:09

I know, the first time I learned I was like that was like wait, what he had, philly in his blood.

Speaker 2 9:14

I had four years of Philly, I know.

Speaker 3 9:16

I found out how about that?

Speaker 1 9:18

How about that trade? It was April 20th 1985. The pirates trade Kent Toccovi to the Philadelphia Phillies for left-handed reliever Al Holland. Did that catch you by surprise? It certainly seemed to catch a lot of Pirate fans by surprise.

Speaker 3 9:33

I was about 30 days old then 30 days old. I was about 30 days old, a young Michael McHenry. Thanks, mike, I just started reading. We love that. I just started reading. He does this every podcast.

Speaker 1 9:43

He does this every podcast. He does this every podcast, I do you treat all the guests the same. Yeah, yeah and his co-host. Go ahead. You guys are only what Old man jokes. Let's go. I was going to say you threw me off so much. Now I forgot the question. So, Eddie, were you thrown off by the trade, as many Pirate fans were?

Speaker 2 10:01

Yeah, it was interesting because I mean number one nobody ever gets traded. At the end of April, it was like the 28th of April, you?

Speaker 3 10:08

said yeah.

Speaker 2 10:09

Yeah, I mean, you just got out of spring training, everybody just got their teams together. They've done whatever moves they were going to do during spring training to put their clubs together and get the season started and then all of a sudden, this trade comes up. So yeah, I was caught completely by surprise and I'm also a little worried because over the years the past 10 years, with the rivalry between the Pirates and the Phillies and what it was I was probably not the most favorite person in Philadelphia with the fans you say if I opened the bullpen door, say you play games against the Phillies.

Unexpected Swap Leads to Standing Ovation

Speaker 2 10:45

If I opened the bullpen door and started walking out on the field from the left field bullpen in Philadelphia at Wettering Stadium, the booze started and they continued all the way until I got to the mound and the game started. And yeah, there were some beers thrown out of the upper deck that came down past me and everything else, just trying to share. I'm trying to figure out exactly how this relationship is going to work out. It could have been St Louis, that would have been different or whatever, but it was Philadelphia and we had the reputation. I go over there, I get there the first. I get traded on Friday. I get there, fly over Saturday morning. We've got a Saturday night game, as luck would have it. Of course, al Holland was their closer, I was our closer, so we're swapping closers. So I'm the new closer, as luck would have it, on Saturday night against the Mets.

Speaker 2 11:39

Eighth inning closing situation comes up. Here comes the trio phone rings get up, get ready. Phone rings, you're in. I don't know what your action's going to be, what's going to happen. Every time I opened that door from that left field side, it was not good. I didn't know what was going to happen when I opened up the right field side, part of just me being me and my personality, and maybe part of what allowed me to be a closer and not get too worried about situations. I walk over to the door and the door swung open out into the field. So I kind of eased the door open a little bit and I stuck my head just to see out the door A little test, just to see what the reaction would be.

Speaker 1 12:26

Tee-ka-boo.

Speaker 2 12:28

Tee-ka-boo. Just let them, see me a little bit at a time. I don't want to just walk out there like I usually did. Well, as it turned out, I ended up getting a standing ovation, and what I had thought all along was all the booing and all the other stuff was actually respect for being like just like we respected. We hated their players, but we respected their players because they were so good. So we got past that part of it Standing O, though Standing O.

Speaker 1 12:54

How about that man?

Speaker 2 12:55

And then go in. Of course, I didn't ever anticipate there being a problem with the players. The players have dealt with that our whole careers. We know players have come and players have gone. Guys you played with and against have changed. But yeah, that was an interesting trade at a very strange time of the year for it to happen.

Speaker 3 13:12

That is weird. And closer for closer that's weird too.

Speaker 2 13:16

Yeah, it was kind of an even swap that kind of worked out the same for everybody.

Speaker 1 13:23

Well, it really worked out for you, because you weren't around for the mess that became the end of the 85 season in Pittsburgh right.

Speaker 3 13:30

They lost the stake in the ground.

Speaker 1 13:32

I mean yeah.

Speaker 3 13:33

They lost the tickaboo.

Speaker 1 13:35

I don't think McHenry or anybody that was not around at the time can truly understand. People talk about how down at times the Pirates have been over the years in terms of the win-loss record, and they wanted the win. Everybody wants them to win, but nothing can compare. You talk about rock bottom. That was rock bottom around here.

Speaker 2 13:53

Well, actually 85 was the beginning of it. Yeah, because I ended up being fortunate, getting traded at the end of April of 85, because by the end of 85, the Pirates had lost 100 games. So I was on 100 loss season. I went to not a championship club, but surely the Philadelphia club did a lot better than what happened here in Pittsburgh. Plus there were some other circumstances surrounding it you know the myself or Al Holland trade and all that. So you know the Pirates knew that the club was going to be sold at the end of the year. They were going to get rid of all the veteran players. I was going to be one of the more popular players. That was not going to be done and another month or so I was going to become a 10-5 player, which meant I could veto a trade. And everybody knew how I felt about being in Pittsburgh and I would have vetoed the trade and then they couldn't have made the trade.

Speaker 2 14:51

It's ruthless the Pirates if they were going to unload and purge after the 85 season, needed to get rid of me and doing it this way, they got rid of me before we got to the 5-10.

Speaker 2 15:04

I could veto the trade and the new ownership group didn't have to do it. So that was on the pirate end. On the opposite side of the equation, al Holland was basically he was very similar to me. I mean, we were both in the same roles, we were both making about the same amount of money. I had a few more years left on my contract. His contract was going to expire at the end of the year. So he comes over here.

Speaker 2 15:31

Well, what wasn't known then that is known now I think it was known probably by the Philadelphia people with the Philadelphia Club was that Al Holland was going to be implicated in the drug trial at the end of the season and the Phillies, being a very PR conscious organization, didn't want to be involved in that. You know him being part of their roster when that happened. So that was kind of the impetus for them to move him to the Pirates. The Pirates weren't going to have to deal with it because his contract was going to expire at the end of the year. Before the drug trial was going to start, he was going to be gone anyway.

Speaker 2 16:12

And then I was out of the way, so the pirates didn't have to trade me and put up with the anguish that was going to come.

Speaker 1 16:20

You wonder if they couldn't come up with somebody else because, as fate would have it, al Holland finishes the year in 85,. And then the drug trials. And then they parade all these players in the courthouse in downtown Pittsburgh. It's national television, all these players coming in and out of these trials in Pittsburgh, and one of theirs is Holland.

Speaker 3 16:41

Go a little bit deeper. Candelaria took me into this.

MLB Player Reflects on Scandalous Era

Speaker 1 16:45

Speaking of Candelaria. John Candelaria took me into this. Well, just speaking of Candelaria John Candelaria, I know you know this, he would end up. Joe Brown, a former general manager of the Pirates, was called upon as an interim GM to come in. He was well-respected. They fired Pete Peterson but there was a whole maelstrom going on in terms of the talk about how things have gotten away from the Pirate Clubhouse, including Pete Peterson, the GM, a really good GM. He set up the 79 team World Series Publicly. Candelaria comes out and calls him a bozo. Our general manager is a bozo.

Speaker 2 17:18

And Joe.

Speaker 1 17:19

Brown comes in and trades Candelaria and a bunch of others.

Speaker 2 17:21

Well, he calls him a bozo, he called him nepotism, because his son was a bullpen coach.

Speaker 1 17:25

That's right, Rick Peterson?

Speaker 2 17:27

Yeah, Rick was a bullpen coach, and he turned out to be a great pitching coach, by the way.

Speaker 1 17:30

Yeah, yeah. No offense to Rick, but you know Candy well things weren't good.

Speaker 2 17:38

Candy wasn't one who handled things not being good.

Speaker 1 17:42

Very well, he's got one speed things not being good.

Speaker 2 17:46

Very well, he's got one speed. No, that's right, he didn't want to. He didn't want to be a part of something that wasn't real good. He was used to being part of something that was good and, uh, you know, he was probably in the same boat that when he got traded, as I was, that it turned out to be a bonus. Yes, right, he got out before. You know, it really got ugly and we got out. We, we didn't have to end up on the 100.

Speaker 1 18:02

Right 100 lost season. You were going to say something about Candelaria telling you something.

Speaker 3 18:07

Yeah, he went into depth about how crazy that was and told me different stories. We'll have to have him on sometime and see if he'll share some of it. But like I mean, what was that? Like Teague, I mean it couldn't have been just in Pittsburgh, it was probably everywhere where things were evident. But it was just like it just got out of control here. And I know you have to leave, but there's drug trials. That's nuts. Most people, especially my age, don't even have a clue that that happened. They think about the Bonds and the Maguires and everything in the steroid era, but they don't think about the 85, 86 era.

Speaker 2 18:39

The only reason Pittsburgh became a central place for it was because the trials were held here. I became a central place for it was because the trials were held here.

Speaker 3 18:47

I mean it was throughout baseball.

Speaker 2 18:48

Right, right, it was the cocaine. There was a lot of stuff going on that, really, I can tell you honestly, I did not. I knew there were some things going on, but I didn't understand that it was as big as it was as widespread as it was throughout the whole game, and how that happens is you do what you got to do, right.

Speaker 3 19:06

If you're not a part of the little clique that's doing that right, you're not going to know. Right, because guys are very secretive when it comes to their personal life.

Speaker 2 19:15

Apparently there's cocaine was around everywhere. I never had anybody ever come up and offer me. I kind of feel deprived.

Speaker 1 19:21

Nobody ever thought enough of me to ask me if I wanted some cocaine.

Speaker 3 19:25

It was everywhere Instead of a rubber band. You want to be a slingshot today, but this was kind of a central location.

Speaker 1 19:30

That's another thing. It was being run in through the courthouse in Pittsburgh.

Speaker 3 19:35

How did that happen? Like why Pittsburgh?

Speaker 1 19:43

Because there was stuff going on. They had somebody involved in the clubhouse, easy access, kind of a well-known personality. That was kind of being a go-between Stay tuned on next, it was an absolute mess.

Speaker 2 19:57

It was a mess. It was legitimately totally larger than I had any concept and I'm sitting right in the middle of it and I had no idea about it.

Speaker 2 20:14

Which actually got to be scary because later on and this is one of the, you know, you have those moments as a parent when all of a sudden something hits you and you go wow, all this was going on all around Major League Baseball. I'm traveling, at least at that time, all around the National League, so I'm intermingling with all these people. You know, apparently there's stuff going on in the clubhouses, there's all kinds of stuff going on and I have no clue. Turns out, rod Scurry, one of our left-handed relievers, was involved in it and the cocaine ended up killing him Killing him.

Speaker 1 20:56

How about that left-handed reliever Teague? How good was he? He was excellent, incredible.

Speaker 2 21:00

He was one of the best relievers around. But I'm sitting at home one night after this has all now come out and I look at my wife, linda, and we got our four little kids and I'm going. If I'm sitting in the middle of this and this is going on this bed and I didn't recognize it, how am I going to know if something happens to one of the kids? One of the kids gets involved in it. Great point. I mean, it was just one of those moments when it just hits you in the forehead and you go.

Speaker 2 21:33

Oh my God, I feel totally helpless here. My own kids, it could happen to him and I won't recognize it and you're thinking of this monster as if something.

Speaker 1 21:44

Oh my god I know right away. Yeah, you don't see that? Yeah I, I saw none the only thing that that that a player would know and anybody around at that time would know and how different times are is that anybody was in and out of that clubhouse. Anybody, it was yeah, it was.

Speaker 2 22:03

There was no 9-11, there was no security no security.

Speaker 1 22:05

Nothing got in and out of the clubhouse. People all over the place think about that. Compared to now.

Speaker 2 22:10

Oh, it's night and day yeah, yeah, I mean it's changed completely now yeah you got to have a credential to go anywhere in the worldpark now. You could come off the street and if you knew the guy that was guarding outside the clubhouse, you'd go inside and see somebody.

Speaker 3 22:25

No, it's not time. Get on in there, go right in.

Speaker 2 22:27

I mean, there were people in our clubhouse constantly and of course we were good, we were popular, Everybody had friends. There were people in and out of there constantly. I imagine every other clubhouse was the same way.

Speaker 1 22:42

So, teague, you spend the time with the Phillies and then you end up with a chance to were you a Reds fan growing up? Oh yeah, I figured you were A Cincinnati guy, ted Ebernethy. We talked about him in the last show, that's right. I don't throw underhand, unless I've got a 10-year-old memory of Ted Everhathy so emulating one of his favorite Reds players and you end up finishing your career. How neat was that? It was really cool.

Speaker 2 23:08

Unfortunately, pete Rose was the manager of the team that year and that year in spring training, like the third or fourth day of pitchers and catchers is when the whole thing broke with him and the gambling and Bart Giamatti and all that Talk about crazy, so that kind of put a shadow over the whole thing for the team.

Speaker 1 23:27

Yeah, really Can we bomb.

Speaker 2 23:30

Personally, for myself, the Reds are such a traditional organization very seldom change anything. The Reds are such a traditional organization, very seldom change anything. So I was literally wearing a uniform that was almost identical to my heroes when I was a kid oh, that's cool Ted Kluszewski, gus Bell, wally Post, frank Robinson, roy McMillan, johnny Temple, joe Nuxall, who grew up right around where I was living.

Speaker 1 23:57

I didn't know that.

Speaker 2 23:58

Wow, yeah, I mean these guys.

Speaker 3 24:00

So it's like a boyhood moment.

Speaker 2 24:01

Yeah, I mean, it's a flashback. My little league uniform turned into a big league uniform and the same little kid Did he give you a fire back. That was six foot four. Now, yeah, was still that same little kid in that uniform getting to play with his favorite team when he was this high.

Speaker 3 24:22

That had to give you some fire, right? That's special, that's really special.

Speaker 2 24:30

It is special and I think every player who ever gets a chance to go back and play where they grew up, whether it's in the middle of their career, whenever it is you know Neil Walker, obviously the obvious example around here that moment has to be so special because you know you idolized that team, those players for so long. They were your heroes. And now to actually now sit down and it's almost overwhelming to think that, wow, now I'm that little kid's hero isn't that crazy I tried that with the graves.

Speaker 2 25:07

Yeah, I don't know if I want that responsibility because those guys were so big I can't be that big.

Speaker 1 25:14

That was 1989, 1989, and you mentioned that the that was 1989.

Speaker 2 25:17

Wow, 1989, my final year.

Speaker 1 25:18

And you mentioned that the stuff was going around with Rose at that time.

Speaker 2 25:22

Right and he still managed the team part of that year.

Speaker 3 25:24

He managed the team for the entire year. Was there whispers of that Like did anybody see that coming, or did it just come out of the blue?

Speaker 2 25:30

It came out of the blue. We actually— I've always wondered that.

Speaker 2 25:38

I wondered that I was. Danny jackson was on that team. Wow, and he and I were. We were living in a motel over in lakeland and training in plant city. So we would ride over to uh plant city every day to go to spring training in the morning and, like I said, we're three or four days into pitchers and catchers regular players most of them aren't even there yet. We drive into the parking lot okay, big deal one. The third or fourth day we drive into the parking lot Okay, big deal, one. The third or fourth day. We drive into the parking lot. There are satellite trucks everywhere. The whole parking lot is filled up with these satellite trucks and all these satellites are set up. What the hell is going on? I mean, the real players aren't even here yet.

Baseball, Gambling, and Retirement Decisions

Speaker 2 26:11

And it was because the news had broken that morning about Bart Giamatti investigating Pete Rose and the gambling. Wow, now I'll take this one step further and then we can drop it and move on. But I got to give Pete Rose I mean what. I will never agree with what he did. Obviously, the biggest rule in baseball is you don't gamble on baseball, and we all knew that from the first day signing every clubhouse Pete Rose. During that entire season. He would not go out on the field for batting practice. He would stay in his office. He would stay away so that all that circus that was going on around him would not bother us. As far as us playing the game wow, um, he took the heat. We, we didn't. We had a ton of guys that were injured. He did everything else. Well, he didn't take the heat.

Speaker 3 27:09

I mean, he was taking his own heat well, yeah, but I mean, he didn't pile it on you guys he did not allow.

Speaker 2 27:14

He let the coaches run the team and we went out and played. Now we didn't play real well because a bunch of guys got hurt and in fact, one writer. I only played until the all-star break. I retired right after the all-star break but one of the writers had come up to me and asked me about is this whole thing with pete affecting the team in the play, the way we're playing? I said I wish we could say that we're just not playing very well and we've got a lot of guys that are hurt.

Speaker 3 27:40

That part of it. You cannot blame it on Pete. That's really cool, I mean. That shows how much he loves the game.

Speaker 2 27:45

Even though he did some things, he shouldn't have as much trouble as he was in, as much as he was going through. He respected the game enough to not take away from us what the game we would, the enjoyment and what we were doing as our careers and just keep it to himself that's the side most people probably have never heard.

Speaker 3 28:06

Well, what?

Speaker 1 28:07

had you heard teak from the, from the veterans who had played for him before 89 the previous couple years, in terms of what kind of a manager he was? Did everybody seem to respect him as a manager? Yeah, I think so.

Speaker 2 28:21

I think you know well part of it. He was a player manager, yeah, and you know. Then the other part, he was just managing, but I think, yeah, the players respected him. I think they don't know anything about what was going on, you know behind the scenes, but as far as knowing the game, running the game and all that other stuff, I think the players respected him a lot. One other little quick story from when he was playing he was playing, I believe, with Montreal at the time when I was with Philadelphia and he was just playing. He wasn't a player manager yet, or no, he was a player manager. I'm sorry, we're playing the Reds and we're playing them in Philadelphia. He is a player manager and some young kid's out on the mound and I have to bat because we're leading and I'm going to stay in the game and he walks me on like five pitches so we get down to first base and I'm taking my lead off of first base, my little you know four-and-a-half-foot lead, when your belly button hits the base yeah, and Pete's.

Speaker 2 29:28

Apparently he's walked a couple other guys before me, so the bases are. So Pete's playing in front of me. So he throws the first pitch. And I looked at Pete and I says Pete, who is this kid? So he makes another pitch. And Pete turns around and looks at me and says you don't have to worry about it, he won't be here very long. If he walked you the next day he was sent out, he was gone.

Speaker 1 29:55

He had those managerial instincts early on Pete Rose did. Do you think he should be in the Hall of Fame even now? Absolutely not. No, why you stick by that?

Speaker 2 30:05

He broke the most sacred rule in the game of baseball. We all were held to that standard and we knew it from day one and absolutely not Even with gambling.

Speaker 1 30:16

Such a part of sports now, and baseball, that's fine.

Speaker 2 30:19

The rules when we play or you don't do it. Does baseball maybe have to take a look and change those rules Because of the fact that they are actually now associated with? Of course, back then it was all illegal gambling. Now you have legal gambling. You have the online stuff.

Speaker 3 30:40

Yeah, they're making a fortune off of it.

Speaker 1 30:41

Everybody's got a phone.

Speaker 2 30:43

Major League Baseball's advertising. They're involved in it, they're partners, all this other stuff.

Speaker 3 30:48

Cincinnati has a sports bet in their stadium.

Speaker 2 30:50

They have it in the stadium.

Speaker 2 30:52

I think there's going to come a time very soon where Major League Baseball has to look at this and say, hey, wait a minute, you know, maybe we have to kind of change. You can't let the players bet on the game because you know the idea is it was a Black Sox scandal in fixing the games and getting involved with the gamblers. But how long is it going to be before Major League Baseball is going to get questioned about umpires' calls, just like the NFL is now about referees' calls, because of the outcome of the game being changed or the outcome of the over-under or whatever being changed?

Speaker 3 31:31

Yeah, the insider information doesn't go anywhere.

Speaker 2 31:33

Yeah, I mean, I can tell you that there were thousands and thousands of times that I'd be walking in and out of stadiums all over the country. Hey Tink, how you doing today, oh, I'm fine how you doing. Good Says. You know, willa got hit last night. How's he feeling? Oh, he's okay.

Speaker 1 31:51

People wanting that inside information any way they can get it. It was the same answer every night, oh you pitched three innings last night.

Speaker 2 31:58

Are you going to be able to throw it tonight? Oh, I think so. It was every time, no matter what the question was, the answer was exactly the same, because I knew what was out there and I knew that I had to make sure that I protected myself against it.

Speaker 3 32:14

Well, think about it. If that guy gets in trouble, who are they going to say? I got the information from Teak. He was my inside source.

Speaker 2 32:23

Well, they wouldn't even have to say that they could trace it back and find out.

Speaker 3 32:27

Yeah, it's crazy.

Speaker 2 32:28

Oh yeah I mean somebody's going to give somebody up?

Speaker 3 32:30

Yeah, exactly Because you're a big whale and they're a little pond fish.

Speaker 1 32:34

So, teek, you went to your hometown team and then you said you retired at the All-Star but you just knew it was time at that point.

Speaker 2 32:41

Yeah, I actually went there. Murray Cook, who became the farm director after Pete Peterson, was the general manager of the Reds at the time. Former Pirate guy. Former Pirate guy. Yeah, he was actually my final couple years in the minor leagues when Pete took over as the general manager, my final couple years in the minor leagues when Pete took over as the general manager, he was the farm director.

Speaker 1 32:59

Ah Pete Peterson became the GM of the Pirates and then Murray Cook was the farm director of the Pirates.

Speaker 2 33:03

Murray Cook became the farm director. Well, he calls I get released by Philly.

Speaker 1 33:08

And now Murray's with the Reds. Yeah, after the 88 season Murray's.

Speaker 2 33:12

The general manager with the Reds Calls me up during the winter and he goes no, I'm 40. I just played at 41. I'm going to be 42 the next year and I had an okay year. I didn't you know, I'm obviously.

Speaker 3 33:25

Were you an oddity? Was there many guys in their, you know, 38 to 42 range season? No, yeah, you were still an oddity.

Speaker 2 33:32

When I retired, there was one person older than me in Major League Baseball. That was Nolan Ryan. He played for five more years and pitched two more no-hitters. He made the rest of us really look bad, by the way, teague.

Speaker 1 33:43

Teague threw 90 games at the age of 40 in 1987.

Speaker 3 33:49

Buckle up, you pirates, let's go.

Speaker 2 33:51

That's what we did.

Speaker 1 33:53

Murray Cook calls you.

Speaker 2 33:54

Murray calls me and he says have you had any thoughts about playing one more year? I said, well, I really hadn't. I kind of figured that 42 after 41 is done. He says, well, I got a couple guys in the minor leagues that are going to be set-up guys in the big leagues they're going to be my set-up guys in the big leagues next year that are young, my setup guys in the big leagues next year that are young, and was wondering if you wanted to play one more year to come in and kind of in the beginning of the season, take some of the tougher spots off of them and let them just kind of settle in and get their feet on the ground and teach them a little bit about relief pitching and whatever you can, and then help them away. And then, as we move along through the season, we'll move them kind of up in the order and we'll move you back down in the order and I would guess that if we were in a pennant race, I probably would have got released and you could have got bad or somebody that you needed. Well, I, you know, I talked to Murray and I, like Murray and I are friends and I said, yeah, okay, I think I can go one more year. So it did. So we go to spring training and you know. Then you know the kids do really well.

Speaker 2 35:04

I start tailing off and by the all-star break I can tell I'm going, I'm heading for my second DL, the one same thing as the year before. The rotator cuff has just worn out. So I call Murray up after the All-Star break and I say you know, the kids are doing good. What would you say if I just retired? We have never had a summer vacation. It's the middle of July. Let me just retire and go. He says if that's what you want to do, it's fine with me. You've done everything I've asked you to do. Blah, blah, blah. So I retire. So, although numerically the last year that I played was that year, in the first year, when I was only up for 28 days, were the two worst years. Number was, I had my career, but I was successful because those two kids were Rob Dibble and Norm Charlton. Oh the nasty boys, those two guys were Rob Dibble and.

Speaker 2 35:59

Norm. Gerald those two guys came along with Randy Myers the next year were the Nasty Boys and ended up beating the Oakland A's. Swept them in the World Series. So my last year was unsuccessful number-wise, but very successful in what the purpose of me being there was.

Speaker 3 36:15

And that impact probably still hits home right here, right, oh yeah, because you impacted their lives forever.

Speaker 2 36:21

That one, the two things other than you know, obviously, the World Series and the games that I've saved in that the two things that really stand out in my career. Having been a closer, I know the value of the setup guy. Okay, that one right there teaching these, getting these two guys in a position where they could help them win a World Series the next year and the year in Philadelphia at the age of 40, you were just talking about where I pitched 90 games and Steve Bedrosian, our closer, won the Cy Young Award. That's great.

Speaker 2 36:56

Now I will be honest now and tell you what I wouldn't have never admitted then there were some of those games that I was in in the eighth inning with a four-run lead, that I just got a little wilder than I would have normally gotten. That by the time Bedrosian came in in the ninth inning it was a three-run lead and he got a save instead of a save.

Speaker 1 37:19

We were going nowhere. A big assist for Teague.

Speaker 2 37:21

This is honesty of a player that's done and doesn't have to deal with it anymore. But yeah, there were a couple times that we weren't going to go anywhere and he had a chance. I love that.

Speaker 1 37:30

That's awesome. A big assist for Teague Bedrosian Bedrock Tee'd them up.

Speaker 2 37:35

That's what the set-up guy's job is to do set it up for the closer.

Speaker 1 37:39

Teek. So you really never had your opportunity to take it all in knowing it was going to be your final year. No, any regrets at all in that respect? Well, I guess.

Speaker 2 37:47

I knew it was my final year, but I literally, over the all-star break, made the decision that it's time now, because the situation was right.

Speaker 3 37:56

The kids were ready. I love that. I mean, it seems like he has zero.

Speaker 2 38:00

I wasn't. I had asked Willie once, right after he retired. I had asked Willie. I says y'all, how do you know when it's time? And he just looked at me and said Teague, you'll know. I agree, you won't look forward. It's not how you're performing, although that's part of it. You can't perform the way you're used to performing. But he says you just won't look forward to getting in the car and going to the ballpark every day, like you did in the past. And I was at that point, you know, I wasn't performing well, I wasn't really needed to teach them anymore, and there were days where I would have, just, at 3.30, rather stayed at home instead of getting in the car and going down to the ballpark.

Speaker 1 38:43

Do you remember your last game, or games at all?

Speaker 2 38:46

Yeah, it was on a Sunday afternoon and I took a loss.

Speaker 1 38:49

You remember that one. That's the matter In Cincinnati.

Speaker 2 38:52

It was the Friday, saturday, sunday after the All-Star, or I guess back then it was Thursday, friday, Saturday, sunday after the All-Star, or I guess back then it was Thursday, friday, saturday, sunday after the All-Star break and on Sunday I In Cincinnati, in Cincinnati, and on Sunday I took the loss in the game and didn't pitch very well and that was kind of the straw that broke the camel's back and that's what. I made the call on Monday to Murray and said, hey, would you mind if I retire, and not long after that.

Speaker 1 39:17

Then you became a broadcaster. You did some. You said you took a year off.

Speaker 2 39:23

Took a year off, did some PR work with the Pirates.

Speaker 3 39:25

And then got into.

Speaker 2 39:26

Yeah, that was back before Steve was doing a lot of the broadcasting, so he was doing a lot of the PR work. Then he got back into broadcasting, so then there was kind of a little void there. They didn't do nearly as much then as they do now as far as PR-wise. So I just kind of whatever they needed I did and did that for a year and then the next year is when I got the call from the Phillies about filling in and doing that.

Speaker 1 39:55

What about Pirates broadcasting? How did that come about then?

Speaker 3 39:58

Yeah, how did you get back here?

Speaker 2 39:59

Well, there was a lot of steps in between. I did the Phillies for seven years and then they wanted me to move to Philadelphia full-time because I was doing more. I was doing about 85 or 90 games a year by then and they were switching networks and stuff like that.

From Player to Broadcaster

Speaker 2 40:15

They were redoing their system and they wanted me. I didn't have to do anything in the offseason in Philadelphia. They wanted me to move to Philadelphia and do that and the kids were in high school, they were in their activities. I didn't want any part of that. So I told them. I said no, I think I'll just stang it up, that'll be fine. And then they got Larry Anderson came in, a couple of the guys and they took care of it all over there. So then I went through a bunch of different things A couple of years I didn't do anything. Then I did the wild things.

Speaker 1 40:46

Tell us about the Washington Wild Things. Did the Washington Wild Things? How'd that come about?

Speaker 2 40:49

They just called me one day and said hey, by the way, we're putting together a baseball team over here. Well, I heard nothing of it. Said we need somebody to run the baseball operations. Would you be interested?

Speaker 1 40:59

The general manager of the Washington Wild Things.

Speaker 2 41:02

Director of baseball operations. General manager has responsibilities on the financial side.

Speaker 1 41:08

You didn't have to pull tarp or anything either, did you?

Speaker 2 41:10

No, I didn't drag infield.

Speaker 1 41:12

I didn't drag infield, but I didn't pull tarp. What was that experience like? Being with the Wild Things?

Speaker 2 41:17

You know it was kind of neat because of my history, about the fact that I was never the guy that was ever wanted, you understood these guys I understood who these kids were and what they were looking for a chance and what that chance meant to them.

Speaker 2 41:32

And initially I'm going what do I want to do this for? I'm going what do I want to do this for? But then all of a sudden it's like I got a chance to give a whole bunch of kids, a chance that I would have loved to have had when I was. You know, independent leagues didn't exist then. Yeah, so I have a chance to help these kids, maybe have a chance to try to get. And we got a couple of guys in the minor leagues. I don't think we ever got anybody to the big leagues, but we got some couple guys in the minor leagues. I don't think we ever got anybody to the big leagues, but we got some guys back in minor league systems and stuff like that.

Speaker 3 41:59

That's awesome. He's giving back to the game so much.

Speaker 2 42:01

That was the incentive for me to do it, because there were so many of me out there that were either overlooked or had been in the minor leagues and got hurt and got released, looking for another chance. You've got to have the chance.

Speaker 3 42:16

Yeah, that's the hardest part sometimes In the Frontier League.

Speaker 2 42:19

At that time I don't know how it is now the maximum age was 27. So you couldn't have veteran players. I think it's open-ended now. So it was all young kids. These are kids out of college. They're kids that played a couple years in the minor leagues and got released, so it was just a second chance.

Speaker 1 42:37

How many years with the Wild Things? I was just there for the first two years, and then was it right after that, the TV you came back to.

Speaker 2 42:44

TV. I think it was another couple years off and then the TV opportunity.

Speaker 1 42:49

How'd that present itself? It's a natural just wondering how it happened.

Speaker 2 42:53

Well, you know I was going down to which TV opportunity we're talking about the Pirate Opportunity now yes, okay. Yeah, we already talked about the Philadelphia. Yeah, yeah, okay, the Pirate Opportunity. I used to go down to spring training every year for spring training, and myself, bill Verdon Sangy, who else was?

Speaker 1 43:15

it. Okay, there were four of us. I was guest instructors. Let me tell you, wangy, who else was it? Maz? Okay, there were four of us over there almost.

Speaker 3 43:18

Let me tell you, Talk about a cool, cool moment Going to spring training. Get to know you guys. That was awesome. It was a difference maker when I came to the Pirates.

Speaker 1 43:30

So I'll never forget it, just the fact that these former Pirate greats were hanging around.

Speaker 3 43:35

T gave me advice to just be who I was and trust the process and put his arm around me. Didn't really know who he was, didn't know a lot about his career, but I went home and looked him up. Same thing with Bill Verde. Like you guys were just normal dudes in uniform and you kind of were off with a little bit of a shadow or an aura, and then you kind of come in and go out, come in and go out. There's something special about that because you had our backs.

Speaker 3 44:00

When we're fighting to make the team, which I had to in 12, I'm there and I'm fighting and you just gave me a little piece of advice. Verdon gave me a little piece of advice and that made me feel like I was being seen, like you were just talking about, because when you are the guy fighting, a lot of times the staff pulls back because they don't want to show favorites. But you guys came up and Manny every single day. Papi, you got to do it like this and he would try. Obviously it didn't move very well at the time, but it meant so much and I wish we still had that, but you guys had a presence In all of our careers.

Speaker 2 44:32

At some point we were that guy yeah exactly we had to make that first team. Yes, you had to fight to get there, so yeah, and we didn't have anybody to help us Exactly, we were on your own. Figure it out.

Speaker 3 44:42

And that's why they were there, and that was the coolest thing.

Speaker 2 44:45

But it was cool for us too. I can imagine now being on this side and wanting to get back on the field again during spring training it felt good so much of your part.

Speaker 2 44:57

you know it was every every. Well, in our case, with the kids, every right after the first of the year we'd go down the floor and I'd, you know, go run on the beach a couple times, or something like that, and get ready for spring training, and then you know, off we went, and then you know that was part of it every year. Well then, you don't have that for a while. Then you get invited to go back and even if you're not doing a whole lot, but you're there and you're around the guys and so that's an exciting part to get involved in. So anyway, getting back to the broadcasting thing, I used to take my RV down.

Speaker 3 45:36

Yes, lived in my RV. I'm an RVer. I was to take my RV down. Yes, lived in my RV. Hey, I'm an RVer. I was an RVer once too.

Speaker 2 45:40

For six weeks I lived in my RV, went to spring training, go back and forth. The camp wasn't very far at all from Pirate City. So spring training's over with. I'm driving back and I'm on the way back. I left a couple days early, like three or four days before camp was over, I think. There's like three road games at the end and a flight to maybe go in someplace to play somebody next to a history game. So I'm already on my way home and I get a call on my cell phone in the RV. Now, this was not my little bitty cell phone.

Speaker 1 46:14

This is a big thing, it's a cell phone. It's attached.

Speaker 2 46:19

I don't think it will work, but it was close to the brick it was relatively close to the brick and the phone rings, and it was at that point in time. Let's see it was FSN, or it was.

Speaker 1 46:31

No, probably, geez, that could have been Fox Sportsnet. I can't remember what derivation we were. Was it Paul?

Speaker 2 46:35

Kassuth? No, I can't remember now.

Speaker 1 46:38

It was past KBL I know KBL was out of the way. It was probably Fox. I think it was Fox Sports.

Speaker 2 46:42

It could have been Fox and they called me up and Sean McClintock is on the phone and he goes we're looking for somebody to be the analyst on the pregame shows. Are you interested? And I said, well, hadn't thought about it. But yeah. He says can you get home in time Because we're opening at home? Can you get home in time? Or no, we may have been open on the road, I can't remember. Can you get home in time? Are you going to be home in time for opening day Because we got a show to do? He says, yeah, I'll be. He says, well, if you're interested in it, it's your job, wow.

Speaker 2 47:22

So, I mean, I'm literally. I had not, at that point in time in my life, had not met Rob King. I did not know Rob. I mean I had met him, but I didn't know Rob King. How cool you're in the RV.

Speaker 2 47:34

Driving in the RV. Yeah, I couldn't get there in time. So I get home a day ahead of time. I says, well, do you want to? You know, this is kind of I'm kind of going back to my first broadcasting job with the Phillies. I says, well, you want me to come down? We'll go over the format, or you know? Look, you know do whatever. Nah, just come on in.

Speaker 1 47:52

We'll just do it. We'll just do it.

Speaker 2 47:54

I've had two. I had two broadcasting jobs in my life. Talk about what we were going to do on the set before I actually sat down on the set.

Speaker 3 48:03

Is that what they're supposed to do? Because they did that to me too, yeah.

Speaker 2 48:06

I think it was it might work. Yeah, it's just like I was punking you. Good luck hey you go to your first call to the big leagues.

Speaker 3 48:12

That took me four years to know there was a rundown. Do you get a?

Speaker 2 48:14

meeting for two days before your first call to the big leagues, before you Go play Go ahead.

Speaker 3 48:20

Go, get them Go play.

Speaker 2 48:23

So I mean, I literally was driving back from spring training, get a cell phone call and three days later I'm now doing pre-game shows for however many. I think we were doing 125 games at that point in time. And then eventually, about three or four years in, then we added we weren't doing or they didn't have an analyst on the post-game show. Three or four years in and we added we weren't doing, or they didn't have a analyst on the post game show. Three or four years in, I ended up starting doing both pre and post game shows and did that for the rest of the 10-year period incredible.

Speaker 1 48:53

And then, uh, a little hiatus for a new heart a little. Well, that was right that was in the middle of it yeah, there, there was a little break here.

Broadcasting and Heart Transplant Recovery

Speaker 2 49:01

In fact, when I went to the hospital, I knew I had problems and they put in the pump. I was wearing the pump. You couldn't see it on the set because it was below the desk. It was a battery pack on your hip. It was hooked up through a wire. It was actually running your heart, a battery pack. I'm walking down the street, did you have?

Speaker 3 49:25

rechargeable batteries at least.

Speaker 2 49:27

Yeah.

Speaker 1 49:29

Oh, golly Better.

Speaker 2 49:29

Yeah Well, during the day, At night you plug yourself into the wall. So you're like a Tesla. Yeah, gotcha, you plug yourself into the wall.

Speaker 3 49:38

You're the first electric car. Got it? Wow Well, you had batteries too. So Got it? Wow Well, you had batteries too. Yeah, so if you had to go, to the bathroom you didn't have to take the cord with you.

Speaker 2 49:45

You lived with your own. But so, anyway, we're doing this, we're doing the post-game shows and all this stuff, and then it's like it just kept morphing itself into more and more and longer and longer and it was just the perfect way, almost perfect way to end my baseball life. It was 10 years back to where I started doing pirate baseball, talking about pirate baseball, involved with the fans, trying to teach them what I had learned over all these years about you know same thing you over all these years about you know same thing you're doing, about how the game is played, why you do this differently. Yeah, yeah, and I I think the biggest compliment I've gotten most often is you taught me so much about the game of baseball and I did not know. You know, and that's coming from men, that's coming from women, that's coming from kids, yep it keeps you going, that's for sure.

Speaker 3 50:43

So that's, that's the gratifying part of you know, having done that and and one thing I want I want to bring up, since you know I preceded, you never could wear your shoes we're not the same size, but your teeth, um. But the family aspect over there, I I didn't realize I was going to get that with the broadcast group, with brownie and and those guys, and also with Rob King and everybody that's behind the scenes.

Speaker 2 51:05

Oh, especially the guys behind the scenes.

Speaker 3 51:07

Right, like the family there gave you that team aspect too. When you don't have it on the field, you need it right? You've had it forever. Right Now you have it again.

Speaker 2 51:16

It's been part of your life, you get it again and don't expect to get it Exactly you expect. You know this guy over here well, he makes tapes and pictures and they plug that in the show. And this guy over here he goes into a booth and reads a script and then they plug that into the show. You don't get. You have no idea until you're involved with it how the interaction is amongst the people on a TV team, especially a TV team.

Speaker 3 51:38

It's one heartbeat.

Speaker 2 51:39

I think radio is probably a little easier because you've just got your people in the booth?

Speaker 1 51:43

Yeah, there aren't as many people involved there are four or five people involved. You've got your engineer.

Speaker 2 51:47

You're doing graphics, you're doing all kinds of stuff on TV.

Speaker 1 51:50

The people behind the scenes TV you talked about that. They're magical.

Speaker 2 51:54

We you and I and Rob King, the people at home think we know all that. We did all that because we're the ones that see, that's what I always felt bad about. They never, nobody at home ever knew a face of anybody that put all that stuff together and made us look that good and that knowledgeable and made the show run so smooth. The producers, the directors, everybody.

Speaker 3 52:23

Yeah, they bring our knowledge to life, which is remarkable.

Speaker 2 52:26

Yeah, and, like you said, the team aspect of it is just.

Speaker 3 52:29

That's something I didn't. I kind of knew, but I'd never been in corporate America. I'd started a business and kind of moved on from that, but when I got there I didn't see that coming. And then when you came back or anybody came back that had been there before, put up the birthday signs, all of it. Like you could tell it was a unit, that was just different.

Speaker 1 52:50

It was really cool. I want you to say the people behind the scenes.

Speaker 2 52:52

Leonard Lee, our producer director here the wizard Guys like that yeah the wizard. Some of the nicknames we couldn't use. We had a couple of guys that we Could not, couldn't use.

Speaker 3 53:05

We had a couple of guys that we could not use, even on a podcast. Can't use it.

Speaker 1 53:06

Well, every now and then I throw out the nickname.

Speaker 2 53:07

Dave Ricchini, I'm talking to you.

Speaker 3 53:09

Hey, can I tell you a quick story about Dave Ricchini. So he just left Sportsnet and I got him a little gift. It was a pair of socks that said the greatest ass of all the asses. And it's kind of a running joke because a couple years ago dave got, you know, promoted as doug's right-hand man doug was our general manager slash executive producer with sean, but I got him a golden cock and I put it at his desk.

Speaker 3 53:37

It's the only thing he took home. Yeah it. It made me like I was a great friend right there, because I love Dave and I'm going to miss him a ton. And you worked with Dave. He produced for you Well I was a little classier than you. Yeah.

Speaker 2 53:49

I used to come in with giant bags of Swedish fish.

Speaker 1 53:53

I've heard this. I was the food guy.

Speaker 2 53:55

I was the food guy.

Speaker 3 53:56

Yeah.

Speaker 2 53:56

And Roger Lenhardt, who was the executive producer Roger brought me in. Yeah, he had his own private bowl of fish that I had a sign on it. Nobody was allowed to touch these except Roger Lenhart. Everybody else can come to my desk and reach into my drawer and get fish. Roger had his own fish.

Speaker 3 54:15

I love it. You got to take care of them because they're taking care of you. I thought I'd tell that story. I've seen Rikini walk out with that rooster.

Speaker 1 54:23

He loved that it was one of his favorite things yeah, it was a rooster Teak how about when you came back from the heart transplant? In a few weeks, you're throwing out the ceremonial first pitch at the wild card game in 2014. Is that right? Wow, that was. You were like Superman. You just had a new heart put in and a couple weeks later you're up on the mound at PNC.

Speaker 2 54:48

Park. Well, I wasn't up on the mound Well close.

Speaker 3 54:51

You were approaching the mound, I was, maybe halfway you were a few steps in front of the mound.

Speaker 1 54:56

You don't have to ruin a good story.

Speaker 2 54:59

I was actually past. The point of the biggest thing is don't bounce it.

Speaker 1 55:02

So I didn't care, yeah, just being out there.

Speaker 2 55:05

If you get a new heart, you don't care if you bounce it. Yeah, exactly, just being there, right. But yeah, it was an amazing time. I mean, obviously there was the lead-up to it and then where I just basically disappeared from TV unbeknownst to anybody, and there was no reason to give, rob did the greatest job in the world of you know, ken maca came in and filled in for me and nobody knew why I was gone and that was. That was just amazing, because I'm going through what I'm going through. We had gotten to the point where the pump that I had just wasn't good enough and, um, it's because you have a huge heart.

Speaker 3 55:45

I did have a huge heart. It literally was. They said it was twice as as it was supposed to be.

Speaker 2 55:51

You gave so much of it it wasn't because I gave so much of it. I beat it up so bad.

Speaker 3 55:58

He hates a compliment, doesn't he? Yes, he does.

Speaker 2 56:00

I don't deserve compliments. I go in and I have the transplant, and that's when the news finally breaks that I've had this heart problem and I get a transplant. I'm in the hospital for eight days. I unfortunately did not break the record. The record was seven days to get out after a heart transplant. I got out on the eighth day, so I was still yelling at my surgeon every once in a while for holding me up for a day. I didn't tie that record.

Speaker 2 56:30

But then 28 days later, after the heart transplant, so AW in the hospital the next 20 days at home. Well, it was a little bit before that, I get a call from the ball club. You know, would you come over and throw out the first pitch at the wild card game? And I'm going. There's no way. So I just said, you know, obviously it was a big story, everybody knew about it. This would be great, but there's no way. So I call up the head of surgery over at AGH and Dr Morale, and I asked. They called me, they asked me you're going to tell me no, but whatever. And he said no. He says you can do it. He says there's only one condition. I said what's that? He says, because of your chest being opened up and having stitches all the way up and down the front of your chest, you can't throw like you used to.

Speaker 2 57:29

You can't throw underhand and throw this way Because he says you're liable to pop your whole chest open, and it'll be stuff laying all over the infield.

Speaker 2 57:36

So he said you have to throw overhand like a normal person. So Dr Morale, my new pitching coach at the age of 65, or whatever the hell I was, has now told me that I have to throw overhand, which I spent my whole life getting away from. Now I've got to go back and throw overhand. But he said I could do it. And which number one just shocked the hell out of me, that he would allow me. Number two, I mean, this is, you know, the wild card game. The wild card game is now. This is what the second wild card game, or the third one, the second of the three yeah.

Speaker 2 58:17

This is the second of the three, so the first one has set the expectations so high because it was so great. And so I'm thinking, okay, everybody in town is excited because we're back in the wild card game again. Well, when they introduced me and I walk out because I don't think it was very well known that I was going to do it, I tried to keep it a secret. When I walked out, when I walked out, the reaction from the people in the ballpark the full house obviously was just overwhelming. I mean, I start choking up just talking about it now, because I'm thinking, okay, some of these people saw me play. A whole lot of them never saw me play. Yes, they've heard the news three weeks ago that this happened, but that reaction was just so overwhelming. And then, you know, to actually be back on the field and throw a baseball to Jared Hughes, who actually requested to be the catcher because he and I had developed a relationship.

Speaker 3 59:34

Back in spring training.

Speaker 2 59:36

You know, everything goes full circle.

Speaker 3 59:38

How about that?

Speaker 2 59:39

So he was the catcher for it.

Speaker 3 59:41

That almost makes me cry.

Speaker 2 59:42

And then you know, then obviously I short hop it to him, because they made me throw overhand.

Speaker 3 59:50

If I could have thrown underhand, I could have. You would have had a little movement to it too.

Speaker 2 59:54

It was just the wrong angle. I didn't have the right release, point All kinds of stuff.

Speaker 3 1:00:00

We'll break that down. That's what we do. We'll get a pitching coach somewhere, do analyze why I didn't get it there.

Speaker 2 1:00:06

but uh, no, that was, you know, number one. It was the honor that they asked me. Number two the reaction of everybody in the ballpark, including which I didn't see, was the um, the reaction of the current players. My nephew, who was there he's the one that told me said, you know, it was prior to the game. The guys are out running their sprints and not getting ready to play a wild card game, and all the guys on the field at that time stopped doing what they were doing and watched, and he mentioned in particular Kutch was one of them. Yep, and you know just the whole thing, the whole sequence going from you don't know if you're going to live or die, or if you're going to get through this transplant operation all the way to within 30 days, you're standing in the middle of PNC Park in a full house. I mean, you talk about going from nowhere to somewhere. That was just unbelievable about that whole thing.

Speaker 3 1:01:25

Your impact has been far and wide from the player aspect I could speak on that probably for hours you and the group of men that surround the Pittsburgh name. Your impact has been phenomenal. That's why Cutch stopped. Because Bill Verdon, because of Bill Mazeroski, because of you, Because you were there. You were there in the toughest moments in some of a guy's career. You were the guy that just came up and patted him on the back and probably sat there. Because that happened to me and it didn't happen to me in Pittsburgh, but it happened to me somewhere else but it happened because I knew that you were the guys to open up to. I knew the guys that could see the tough.

Lessons From Veteran MLB Players

Speaker 2 1:02:06

It happened because the guys before us did the same thing for us. Yeah, and you carried on, I've got a time where we were talking earlier about in 74,. I come up for 28 days, I stink, I get sent back to minor leagues, I get dropped off the roster and you think it's over, then right, You're just like what am I going to do?

Speaker 2 1:02:26

now I mean I'm done and all of a sudden circumstances I get another chance in 75 to come back to the big leagues. So I'm down in Charleston when Steve Blass is going through the worst thing you can possibly go through in his life, full circle. Go through in his life, full circle. Steve Blass is the one who took me aside and said you know, he knew what I'd done last year, that I'd been up, and he didn't tell me directly. He told me what, something that Don Audsborn, who was still the pitching coach at the time, who was his pitching coach had told him. He says just go up there, throw it over the plate, the hitters will let you know if it's good enough or not. And I went back with it. They weren't the big league hitters anymore. They weren't the guys that you had to make a perfect pitch, or else they're going to hit the ball out of the ballpark. Throw it over, they'll let you know if it's good or not.

Speaker 3 1:03:22

We'll tell you everything you need to know.

Speaker 2 1:03:23

And that's exactly what I did, and that was the total difference between the time before and the time after.

Speaker 2 1:03:31

So, anything that I passed on to you or anyone else like that during my times during spring training was just me passing on what Steve Blass had done for me or so many other guys when I first came up. The other guys when I first came up, the veteran teammates. When I first came up you know you hear the stories about Doc Ellis and what a character he was and all this other stuff. He went out of his way more probably than anybody else on that team when I first came up, even in 74, when I wasn't very good of going out of his way, and he came over to my locker one day when I first came up, even in 74, when I wasn't very good of going out of his way. And he came over to my locker one day and he says you're a sinker baller, I'm a sinker baller. He says anytime you want to know about any of these hitters in this league, you come and ask me. I'll tell you what I know about all the different guys and how they approach a sinker ball pitcher.

Speaker 2 1:04:26

So you put that. You put that with Blass, you put that with numerous other guys. We're not doing anything else that somebody in you did it. You're doing it for somebody else now. I mean, that's part of the beauty of the game and the team sport and what makes it so special. It's not just 25 guys, it's the ones that were before them or the veterans that are with them, helping them to get there, and then you feeling the responsibility to pass it on to the next group. Amen, and that's one of the most gratifying things you can get out of being a professional baseball player.

Speaker 1 1:05:05

The rubber band man.

Speaker 2 1:05:06

Kent.

Speaker 1 1:05:06

Ticolvi, teek, teek, you are the greatest.

Speaker 3 1:05:11

Teek, you're the best.

Speaker 1 1:05:13

For being on. Hold my Cutter, we'll drink to that.